Dion Kerr Interview

0:19 Luke F. Walton What's good, everybody? I am Scoobert Doobert with Love Music More, and I am joined with Dion Kerr, awesome multi-dimensional artist. I love that because some of your stuff takes me out to space, man. Instrumentalist, producer, arranger, songwriter, photographer, videographer, runs the gamut of the creative arts. So I'm excited to dig into this, man.

0:41 Luke F. Walton I just want to welcome you to the pod and let's have a great conversation. Make the people love music more.

0:49 Dion Kerr Yeah, agreed. No, thank you for having me. Looking forward to this.

0:52 Luke F. Walton Yeah, 100%. So one of my favorite ways to start this off is to kind of just ask the question of what got you into this? What was the spark or the series of sparks that kind of led you down, you know, the path of music making and just being a creative in general?

1:11 Dion Kerr Well, I guess for me, it started with my family first that

1:16 Luke F. Walton Cool.

1:17 Dion Kerr my father was a musician. So he was a guitarist and a singer and he played in different bands, mostly kind of in the folk genre.

1:27 Luke F. Walton Okay.

1:28 Dion Kerr And then I also have an older brother who was an amazing drummer, touring artist, and he also is a multi-instrumentalist, plays guitar and bass. primarily on drums but so

1:41 Luke F. Walton Cool.

1:41 Dion Kerr I grew up in a very musical household my mother doesn't play music but she's just like a music lover you know just

1:48 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

1:48 Dion Kerr grew up singing and dancing in our house it was just like a typical day you know but

1:55 Luke F. Walton Cool.

1:55 Dion Kerr I got into performing early on just you know having instruments around the house I took piano lessons growing up studying classical music you um and then i started just playing drums and bass and guitar just because that's what was in my house at the time

2:12 Luke F. Walton i love it so wait so were you were you like having musical conversations with your family like where would you guys jump on and like like jam together and stuff that's

2:19 Dion Kerr yeah definitely yeah like

2:21 Luke F. Walton so cool

2:21 Dion Kerr my father was my first teacher um i remember him you know showing my brother and i songs so we would play in a trio setting just you know drums bass guitar at our house so i grew up with that setting and then In middle school, I started playing, you know, the classical instruments, like I played some tuba, some

2:40 Luke F. Walton Nice.

2:40 Dion Kerr clarinet even.

2:41 Luke F. Walton Sweet.

2:42 Dion Kerr Um, and then in high school, my brother was already there. He was like two years ahead of me, but he was in drum line and I really loved seeing him in drum line when I was graduating middle school. So in high school, I auditioned and just became in the drum line. Cool. So I actually played drums for four years of high school. We didn't have a jazz program or anything that I could play bass on.

3:05 Dion Kerr So I just played bass and studied myself outside of. of high school on electric and upright bass um

3:13 Luke F. Walton dang cool awesome so yourself uh were you were you did you have a teacher um for like upright and and stuff or are you you kind of teaching yourself because that that instrument's freaking hard man yeah

3:24 Dion Kerr yeah i didn't at first i just was studying you know electric bass i had a fretless bass i was really into jaco and

3:32 Luke F. Walton yeah yeah

3:32 Dion Kerr being from south florida too like the legacy of jaco was definitely a huge influence on me at that time so i had you know i stripped my frets i did the whole Jaco thing took the frets off my bass filled

3:46 Luke F. Walton Mm

3:47 Dion Kerr it

3:47 Luke F. Walton -hmm.

3:47 Dion Kerr with wood putty so i'd have a fretless bass like i just wanted to be Jaco at

3:51 Luke F. Walton that Yes.

3:51 Dion Kerr time but then you know i started playing gigs around town and people were really encouraging me to you know you should learn the upright bass as well um so

4:03 Dion Kerr I ended up getting an upright my junior year of high school and just was self-taught for a while and my teacher was a guitarist so I was

4:11 Luke F. Walton Oh, cool.

4:12 Dion Kerr learning from him but I was playing electric and upright bass

4:15 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

4:16 Dion Kerr and

4:16 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

4:17 Dion Kerr playing along to records and mainly playing by ear at that time until I got to college and then that's when I really started like the deep dive of like musical studies like reading

4:28 Luke F. Walton Yes.

4:29 Dion Kerr music harmony you know all that stuff just like getting deeper into the things that I kind of just had known by ear but like then I was like able to put you know words to what I was trying to do or hear

4:43 Luke F. Walton I love it and I for the for the listeners that don't know uh so the the little lines on guitars that's the frets on the fretboard and that that allows you to press pretty much anywhere in there it's going to sound at that note and when you take the fret off now you have all of the stuff in between like one of the pods that I talked about was like chromatic and then also like atonal or um you know all that good stuff microtonal stuff um upright and fretless bass allow you to do all sorts

5:11 Dion Kerr all sorts of things with sliding into notes and playing in between notes and and whatnot and that's that's one of the reasons why i find upright so difficult is uh not only the change in like the vertical access instead of playing more horizontally diagonally you're playing up and down like upright base um Mm but

5:28 Dion Kerr -hmm also the the micro tonality and the like less familiarity of where your hands are even supposed to be because it's it's a different beast So I have a lot of respect.

5:39 Dion Kerr no i love what you said about that too like the being able to you know play in between the notes because that's something you know when i was playing fretless bass like the expressiveness you can get out of a fretless is so nice you can really bend give vibrato and all that stuff and then When I play fret threaded instruments, I try to still get

5:59 Dion Kerr Oh, cool. those Yeah. sounds that I can on fretless, like figuring out how to get a vibrato on a fretted bass or playing those slight bends and still getting that expressiveness out of a fretted instrument. But it's really nice to play fretless. I think everyone should. experiment with both because it just opens up you know different worlds for sure

6:20 Dion Kerr Totally. And what great ear training. You don't have any crutches anymore. There's no like training wheels on the bus. You just got to figure it out by your own ear and your own vibe. So that's a really special thing, especially from the bass because so much of tuning comes from the bottom up. And so it's vital and it's also sometimes harder to intonate. in lower

6:41 Dion Kerr Very registers rather true. than higher registers so it's a it's a great great challenge for for musicians and i agree i mean the the great upright bass players that i know they're the they're the baddest mfers in all music yeah yeah it's sweet so what a cool combination a lot of the bassists that i talked to they play bass because they wanted to play drums and they're like i wasn't very good at that so i'm gonna do this so cool that you play

7:08 Dion Kerr Both. How do you think that's influenced your ability to communicate with drummers or like lock with drummers? Do you kind of feel like you can get inside their head or understand where their instincts are going on kind of a deeper level because you're native to that instrument as well?

7:25 Dion Kerr yeah i think that actually does really help like it gives you insight into how drummers tend to phrase things you know the layout of the kit and how certain phrases certain roles and just you know like learning the phrasing of drummers like in just where they end up coming out of their fills and stuff like when you're trading fours or something like

7:47 Dion Kerr Yeah so you don't get lost like sometimes playing drums like you like you see things from their perspective so you can really like keep on beats in certain settings you know and just the way you know the drums and bass that interaction

8:02 Dion Kerr um how they play together and really create different feels you know with the drummer you know being on top the bass behind and vice versa like experimenting with the beat and all that stuff it's nice to see things from both sides having played drum gigs on and being up been on tour as a drummer and then also doing that as a bass player it really it's just a eye-opening experience too seeing it from both perspectives

8:29 Dion Kerr I think everyone should play a little drums, even on all instruments, not even just bass, because the rhythmic foundation is pretty much everywhere in all music. And I think everyone should play a little bit of drums, just it enhances your phrasing ability, your just everything. I feel like it just, you know. I don't know. I'm a big

8:50 Dion Kerr i proponent of everyone playing the drums. agree with you that that's what i felt like that unlocked my and percussion or whatever that unlocked my like sense of grid on a really deep level because i you know i came up playing garage rock and blues guitar and stuff and it was all very like vague fuzzy outlines of where rhythm actually is you know like listen to like a bunch of 60s and 70s guitar solos and they're just kind of

9:15 Dion Kerr mushy floating on top sometimes and it's not as um like locked as when i started getting into more like motown and funk and disco and whatever and then it's and it's like okay understanding how to play drums how to play percussion and where that sense of division subdivisions are um that really opened up guitar for me like in a real professional way before i was just kind of like

9:41 Dion Kerr floating and just following my ear but then the sense of grid allowed me to to lock and and you know become a serviceable musician oh

9:51 Dion Kerr No, definitely. yeah Yeah. And playing with, you know, great drummers really is just like an eye-opening experience always like you just have to meet them at their level. So I was definitely fortunate to be around a lot of great drummers. Growing up that pushed me, you

10:07 Dion Kerr sure know in those ways rhythmically and all that stuff yeah and that's something that i um you know i was i was lucky to have some of that too but i i didn't have quite the um

10:19 Dion Kerr musical vocabulary I guess until I until I you know went to music school and stuff and then started playing with people was like dang like there's a there's a different level here and you're right like having to meet them meet them where that is and then you also learn like through osmosis just kind of being around that like grooves and feels I'd love to talk to you a little bit more on kind of like behind the beat ahead together the separation the pocket

10:46 Dion Kerr it um and kind of like how that's different across different musical genres and across different players i just love to just you know dig into that a little bit more because i think it's a fascinating subject that a lot of music fans like feel and it like hear

10:58 Dion Kerr Mm this pocket -hmm but they don't really understand like what goes into that what what are we talking about like how how how are these things interacting what are you listening for are you listening to the hi-hat you're listening to the kick or like how are you how are you playing with those things i know that a lot of that's intuitive But I just would love to share some of that musical understanding with some of the listeners here.

11:21 Dion Kerr Yeah, I guess that's, you know, I always try to let the, I guess, music dictate what I'm supposed to do. And so I approach every setting differently. So if I'm playing, you know, a pop gig or if I'm playing, tracking for an indie artist and they want me to play with a pick.

11:41 Dion Kerr Yeah. and play on a four string and get that sound or if I'm playing something more R&B and I have to play five string and like have a different feel regards to what the music is doing so I try to always keep an open perspective but basically your knowledge is everything so I feel like I try to listen to everything absorb everything

12:03 Dion Kerr I check out all musics, all genres, and I guess I've been lucky to play a lot of different stuff in studio settings to where I've just had to check out this music deeply to go be able to replicate it authentically for this session or get this sound. So I really try to be a student of the music always. I approach everything differently. It depends what the music is calling for, but I'll listen to the drums and

12:32 Dion Kerr Yeah. hear what the kick drum is doing. A lot of times the kick and the bass should sync up. It's not always the case, but I think it's a good starting point, especially for people who are just trying to get into different genres and stuff, listening to the kick drum, locking in the bass with the kick.

12:53 Dion Kerr um and just like getting good at playing parts and stuff too like being okay with playing your part and just nailing that part before

13:03 Dion Kerr Cool. there's any fills or anything i feel like i just always try to go in and let me play my part like authentically first before i start to break away and do all the cool other things and so i'll just try to really just focus on groove and let me just play a couple notes

13:20 Dion Kerr making sure that fits the groove for whatever record we're doing and and just you know i always start with that simplicity is always better in in recordings too like i feel like live i always can go off more but like for records something is nice about just playing simple and locking in with that but i would say like different bands that i'm in like one of my projects like the smoojis

13:45 Dion Kerr where we have two drummers and my role can kind of fluctuate between playing some bass playing some guitar stuff on a six string bass but i tend to play with a different feel you know i play with my fingers maybe i lay behind the beat more we're trying to create more like i don't even know what the feel is like it's a more open feel because

14:08 Dion Kerr Yeah, yeah, of the two drummers like it's very elastic the two drummers like it's very elastic and open and there's a lot of space between the notes for me to play a little more like this you know I can kind of like bounce back and forth between different things Or maybe one of my other bands like C Foam Walls is more on the indie rock side and I'm just like playing parts. I want to just play right

14:31 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

14:32 Dion Kerr on the grid. We're just trying to lock in like all, you know, like just par playing. There's no like improvisation and stuff and that too. So to me, like those are like two projects that I see like very differently on how I approach playing that gig.

14:49 Luke F. Walton It's

14:49 Dion Kerr And

14:49 Luke F. Walton a really cool and

14:50 Dion Kerr they're equally as fun.

14:51 Luke F. Walton I like that too. I like it when people can celebrate all genres or the differences, even if there's ones that you can kind of dip into your technical ability and whatever versus locking in with parts, but there's beauty in both.

15:09 Dion Kerr Definitely, yeah.

15:12 Luke F. Walton Curious about... different genres and like you know like latin music i think is the best example like with like playing against the clave and and a different sort of heartbeat rather than maybe indie pop or something that's like very a four count kind of thing

15:29 Dion Kerr Mm

15:30 Luke F. Walton how

15:30 Dion Kerr -hmm.

15:30 Luke F. Walton do you how do you adjust kind of your musical center or do you think that's that's all just kind of intuitive understanding as you like dig into a genre and you like understand the vocabulary

15:42 Dion Kerr yeah i mean i yeah that's a tricky one because

15:45 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

15:45 Dion Kerr it's like um well i did get to play in ignacio baroa's trio though so he when i got that call i immediately dove into his music and was you know checking out all the clave stuff all that you know just before i went to play with them but then when i showed up to play with them he told me to disregard all that he's like i don't really care if you play the traditional stuff i want you to play you

16:10 Luke F. Walton Cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

16:11 Dion Kerr which i thought was really you know refreshing um having that you know i don't i don't feel like i know all the quote-unquote like right things to play over certain

16:25 Dion Kerr things you know like I'm I feel like I can stand in those gigs but I don't necessarily do it like the most authentically but he was really just pushing for us as that trio to play what we felt and rhythmically I could communicate with him in different ways like maybe it wasn't authentic in

16:46 Dion Kerr the traditional sense but I could still communicate with him in the way I was familiar with rhythmically and it still worked we still had a very solid lock between the bass and drums but he wanted it to be this open thing he

17:00 Luke F. Walton Cool.

17:01 Dion Kerr didn't want it to be defined like he was just like I want it to be whatever it is just play you lock in you know we have to groove together but it doesn't have to be

17:12 Dion Kerr a particular thing i don't want you to have to stick to this particular bass line because that's what it's supposed to be like

17:18 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

17:19 Dion Kerr he you know so you know in a lot of the settings i've gotten to play different styles like a lot of times it's not necessarily like playing the right thing in a way i feel like you should always just play what you you're bringing to the table because at

17:35 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

17:35 Dion Kerr the end of the day people are hiring you and your voice and

17:39 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

17:39 Dion Kerr as long as you can still fit in the mold of the band and you're still making the band sound better it can just be whatever you feel and you know in some way you have to make that you know work in in the situation but um i still had the knowledge in the back of my head though like i i approach every gig like from a very studious point like i i go and study the music i memorize everything

18:06 Dion Kerr i i dive super deep into the music so i can get on the the bandstand and forget all of it but that's always like the goal so like i i know everything that's supposed to be i studied all this i know all this i memorize the music but then at the end of the day like they just want to hear your voice in this music like how can you step out of the genre and still be like oh i know this is that bass player even if it's

18:34 Dion Kerr on this music or it's on a indie record or it's on an R&B record you can be like oh I still know the sound and approach of that bassist or whatever you know trying to have your sound cross all those boundaries and and and find your sound that's so uh iconic that it can be different things you know like so that's something I think about when I approach different genres like I want to play authentically but I also want to

19:02 Dion Kerr retain my voice in everything I do.

19:06 Luke F. Walton I think that's great wisdom too. And it's, it's simultaneously like less pressure and more. because it's like hey

19:13 Dion Kerr Yeah.

19:13 Luke F. Walton you don't have to it's not like you're you're doing a concerto or whatever and even that i think a lot of people they bring their own voice to that but like like it's not like you're you're getting graded on how accurately you are reading the articulations that are presented to you on the sheet music you are internalizing it i like the idea of yeah being very studious and humble coming to the work

19:37 Luke F. Walton absorbing it and then also being confident enough in the voice that you've created over listening to a whole bunch of different music, finding the through lines, developing your own personal taste and your own personal style so that you're confident that you can bring that to all the different prisms. But like that one thing is the light that's you and then the prism is how you diffuse it. That's cool.

19:59 Dion Kerr Definitely.

20:00 Luke F. Walton yeah that's

20:01 Dion Kerr I

20:01 Luke F. Walton really funny

20:01 Dion Kerr like the way you put it.

20:03 Luke F. Walton i

20:03 Dion Kerr Even

20:03 Luke F. Walton know

20:04 Dion Kerr better than I can explain myself.

20:06 Luke F. Walton i like it you know it's it it helps me because you know these are these are the goals that i feel like all artists have is like how do you what do you at the end of the day you know it's like there's a lot of copying and imposter syndrome and all of those things along that are built in that's part of the process but like how do you

20:27 Luke F. Walton How do you transcend that and swallow that all together so that it becomes a new thing that you're giving to the world? And I mean, I hear it in your music. I'd love to talk to you about kind of the musical conversations that you've been having, the YouTube series Dialogues. I'd love to kind of hear about where that idea came from, how you've been doing that and kind of what that all has in store.

20:51 Dion Kerr Yeah, well, that first, it was kind of inspired by... My friend who I featured in the first episode, this amazing drummer, David Shiverton.

21:00 Luke F. Walton Mm

21:00 Dion Kerr So

21:01 Luke F. Walton -hmm.

21:01 Dion Kerr he has a series called the Shiverton Sessions, which I got featured on in two different projects.

21:07 Luke F. Walton Cool.

21:08 Dion Kerr But I just really liked that he, you know, basically like the things we were kind of talking about, he created his own voice and his own thing, you know, trying to navigate the social media and how we should.

21:23 Dion Kerr promote ourselves this day and age too like you want to do it in an authentic way a lot

21:29 Luke F. Walton Mm

21:29 Dion Kerr of times

21:29 Luke F. Walton -hmm.

21:29 Dion Kerr I felt like I didn't want to just post a

21:32 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

21:32 Dion Kerr lot of videos on my Instagram like I kind of wanted to present more works and stuff so this was like my way of like filtering my creativity into something that can serve a lot of different things you know just like

21:49 Dion Kerr as content or just you know premiering new works and and all those things that wrapped into one um one thing and i thought of the idea of just like having a dialogue between me and one other person being

22:01 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

22:02 Dion Kerr like something unique that you

22:04 Luke F. Walton Totally.

22:04 Dion Kerr know based and whatever it was like and uh just bass and drums at first with no other instruments like i was like okay this could be interesting let me

22:13 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

22:13 Dion Kerr see if i can write an arrangement so i featured dave on the first one just because he was helping me inspire and push me into doing this in the first place um and that one just you know had such great feedback that i was like okay i'm gonna just keep doing this and next i featured tim watson who i have a lot of projects with now um and then most recently i featured this singer

22:37 Dion Kerr Nicole who we just started a project and have an album with

22:40 Luke F. Walton Oh,

22:40 Dion Kerr but in

22:40 Luke F. Walton awesome.

22:41 Dion Kerr the future I want to work with you know dancers even bring some visual artists and

22:46 Luke F. Walton Cool.

22:46 Dion Kerr kind of push the boundaries of the like what this dialogue could be and not just have it be musicians like I really want to expand you know yeah who I can collaborate with even maybe a poet or

23:00 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

23:01 Dion Kerr something like that so that's like the future of what I want to push with this project and right now it's just a YouTube series but I'm also hoping to turn this into a live show or performance or something I can bring on the road where I can just feature people in their own city it was also like an economical way of figuring out how to tour without touring with a whole band because things

23:26 Luke F. Walton Mm.

23:26 Dion Kerr are so tough to you know take four people on the road get hotels like so I was also thinking of this in the back of my head like this is something I could present and just there's such amazing musicians all around the world like I can go to a city and find someone that I'm friends with online and be like can we collaborate on the show and it'll still be a dialogue as a live performance but

23:51 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

23:52 Dion Kerr then I can fly to another city and just play you know the same or different music but feature another artist and still kind of like have it all fit under one umbrella but it's like

24:03 Dion Kerr um i guess the thing tying it together is it's music that i wrote or arranged um

24:08 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

24:08 Dion Kerr that's like the only connecting thing but i try to write for whoever i'm featuring thinking of them in mind like oh i'm writing this for dave because i know he's gonna go crazy on that drum solo like i'm writing this thing for tim because i know his soundscapes are so amazing like let me do something that it's going to just be an open canvas for him to do whatever he does the best you know but

24:35 Luke F. Walton I love that.

24:36 Dion Kerr yeah I'm hoping there will be more you know I'm working on some things right now so to push this project even further than what it is with these couple videos on YouTube so far but this is definitely just the start of that

24:51 Dion Kerr I love the vision. It's such a, I feel like vision is one of the defining characteristics of like an artist where it's like you, it might not all be there yet, but it's like you have this grand idea of how could it all integrate and turn it into something more than like you were saying, like disposable content. It's like, this is the opposite of that. This is building content. This is foundational content.

25:13 Dion Kerr It's not even content. It's like, it's your work. it's Right. it's you know and that that's where i think that's where i honestly think social media is going just in general is like anybody can make little skits or whatever but is that really what you want out of your your artists in the world it's like i want that like one of my friends uh nico seropolis he uh went to thornton school music with me he um he did a

25:40 Dion Kerr keyboard small uh ensemble i think like string quartet and percussionist and then tap dancers and it was like his like kind of senior thing and then he went on and toured that a little bit and i thought it was the coolest thing ever because it was like there were improvisational sections where the tap dancers would do something and that would influence what he played on jazz piano and vice versa and then it would go to the percussionist and it was this whole cool

26:05 Dion Kerr whole conversation of different mediums different artistic things but all unified in sound and movement and it was like that it felt that kind of stuff i think is the future because it opens people's minds and it also connects it with like the things we know about music like

26:24 Dion Kerr musicals and and underscore and video games like the all of the interactions but then you get to see it viscerally in a deeper level and i think that's just like it's a really cool thing for you to be be pointing your ship towards it's really cool

26:39 Dion Kerr Oh, thank you. Yeah, I for sure. know Nico's, isn't he from Miami? He might be, man.

26:44 Dion Kerr I think I think I know he Nico's. might be. Yeah, You know Nico's? I think he went to New World. Yeah, he's

26:48 Dion Kerr That dude's bad. amazing. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. His brother's also a burning saxophonist. Yeah, they're crazy talented. Yeah.

26:59 Dion Kerr It's amazing the kind of talent that's out there that people haven't really heard yet. I hope they all do because. It's the world will be better for it kind of thing, you know

27:08 Dion Kerr I'm always shocked to see that like not enough people get the attention and love they deserve because I mean the internet is great for that you know like I find a new artist every day that I'm just you know shocked about and then sometimes i'll go to their page and i'm like oh they're you know they only have a couple followers a couple things but it's like

27:30 Dion Kerr Yeah. wow this like impacted my day so much and i feel like we all could do better in our community like uplifting everyone because like you know it's just at the end of the day you know we only are showed certain percentage of media or the top artists are here but there's really an unlimited amount of artists and talent around the world and i

27:53 Dion Kerr Yeah. hope that you know those barriers even get broken down even more and we were able to see these things um even easier like everyone definitely um well like i've just been influenced by so many people i can't even begin to name the amount of people um that have influenced me but i wish i could give them each each

28:18 Dion Kerr But yeah, hopefully they'll all, you know, be recognized at some point for their stuff.

28:25 Luke F. Walton Agreed. And also I think like us as music fans. Like identifying and changing the way that we react to like numbers is a positive thing. It's like now that I have more listeners, people talk to me differently. But why? you know i Right, just it's

28:45 Dion Kerr right.

28:45 Luke F. Walton the same but it's but it's not it's like there's like a psychological effect of like you see big number you know it's popular and now it like looks a little shinier because it's popular but it's like if we can identify that as a weird little psychological effect then maybe we could fight against it like we do other psychological effects and like just

29:04 Dion Kerr Right,

29:05 Luke F. Walton try

29:05 Dion Kerr right.

29:05 Luke F. Walton to just listen like absorb it because that that person may be massive someday or they may never

29:10 Luke F. Walton ever have a big audience but they could be genre defining or they could chart an entire new course of of music musical exploration or mixed media or like there are all of these kind of like seeds that should be watered and appreciated and a lot of people that like shouldn't have a day gig they should be focusing on this but there's just there's not like the economics or the popularity or whatever but we could change that by just kind of opening our our minds a little bit more and

29:38 Luke F. Walton Getting out of the popularity equals ability kind of, yeah.

29:44 Dion Kerr For sure. I think even like the small victories like so many things go a long way just like a little shout out or reshare for

29:54 Luke F. Walton Yeah,

29:55 Dion Kerr you know it it really does like mean a lot to like independent artists like

30:00 Luke F. Walton it's true.

30:00 Dion Kerr so i think we all could do even better that like we we gotta hype ourselves up like

30:05 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

30:05 Dion Kerr you're saying with this podcast you know we're trying to bring everyone together like I think that's something that the music community sometimes lacks like sometimes

30:14 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

30:15 Dion Kerr we're all pinned against each other like there's only this many venues there's only this many gigs we're

30:21 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

30:21 Dion Kerr all fighting for the same space it is tough you know and it it can create some of that battling mentality but at the same time I think that musicians, if we gathered our power even more separate

30:36 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

30:36 Dion Kerr from the venues and all this other stuff, like if we really were united even more, I think it's going to benefit all of us in the long run, like over the venues, over the promoters and all this stuff, like we really do have the power.

30:53 Dion Kerr over these things sometimes and you know sometimes we let the venues or the promoters get the best of us but

30:58 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

30:58 Dion Kerr it's like i really hope um we can grow the community and just like have everyone everyone really you know be more mindful and helping each other out it's a tough journey being a musician it's already difficult enough so

31:14 Dion Kerr if you if we make it more difficult with each other it's just like it's almost unbearable at that point like

31:21 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

31:21 Dion Kerr it's already so tough we already you know spend so many hours doing what we do just like i'm just hoping these little victories and these little things you know that could bring a tiny bit of light to somebody sometimes those things go a long way and we don't realize it

31:38 Luke F. Walton yeah and i think some music fans don't know the ways that they can affect change like band camp it's a great

31:46 Dion Kerr Mm

31:46 Luke F. Walton place

31:46 Dion Kerr -hmm.

31:46 Luke F. Walton if like especially because you then you can download the high-res audio like you get the full wave and then the artist gets way more money like you'd have to stream for like a year kind of situation not to say that streaming is not is bad or anything i really like streaming too i do it it's convenient it's great but like for the ones that you really rep and the ones you know they're independent

32:07 Luke F. Walton they're independent they're grinding they're trying to get out of the day job hustle or whatever like throwing them a few bucks on band camp can make their day change their trajectory um and i think like people interacting a little bit more like taking the next step from i just kind of like add people to playlists or scroll through curated playlists and i don't really like listen to the artist i just listen to the song it's like take that next leap like get to know that artist maybe reach out follow them on socials or

32:33 Dion Kerr DM them and maybe figure out a way to like get money to them and uh and make their days and maybe like make music yourself so you can kind of like get the feeling for all that goes into getting great at this thing that is uh it's really difficult but um very rewarding at the same time

32:50 Dion Kerr yeah even like using social media to our benefit is Yeah, like i right. really think some people feel intimidated to just dm artists or that might seem bigger than them or but like so many things that have happened to me that have been great or even

33:07 Dion Kerr with with our bands you know like we've just sent artists our music or just dm them being like we you're like one of our favorite bands and we love your music it's funny when you realize how many people actually respond and like they're all just normal people like us too like they're and you know sometimes obviously these artists won't see your your dm but that's like the worst that can happen there's no bad outcome out of putting yourself out there

33:34 Dion Kerr like the worst that could happen is maybe you don't get written back and that's really not a bad thing but

33:39 Dion Kerr No. like in some of my bands like we've gotten huge opportunities just by making a connection like that and just reaching out to someone and they're just happy to hear that we love their music too and like hey do you guys want to open for us on this bill when we come to your town like there's there's a lot of things that can just happen that out of like a small effort Um, yeah,

34:01 Dion Kerr yeah and like a and I try always, like an honest effort like a community effort not just being like hey give me something it's like hey like let's connect let's let's be let's be part of each other's worlds and like make each other better and give to each other i mean that that was the same way that i i mean i i got my biggest opportunity just by dming somebody that posted one of my songs in a story i saw that they posted i hit them up and then

34:24 Dion Kerr you know my one of my songs is in japanese movie theaters it's like weird left turn on left turn but it is like the coolest thing that i've done in my career because

34:34 Dion Kerr That's awesome of it you know you're right it's it's like getting over the fear and also but also bringing the right mentality to it like i get dms from people that are just straight up like thirsty or

34:50 Dion Kerr the wrong they give you the wrong impression of like hey you you owe me something and

34:55 Dion Kerr Right, it's like right. like whoa yeah but like if somebody hits me up and is like hey like actual conversation like i was listening to this song i heard how it fit mine and like whatever it's like hey now we'll now we do a collab and that that that's happened like one of my best buddies uh con who was who i did on the podcast he just he hit me up in the same way and then we started doing collabs and he's one of my my best friends now so it's how it goes

35:18 Dion Kerr yeah that yeah finding out how to to interact with one another too yeah like Yeah.

35:24 Dion Kerr we we don't want to be asking each other for free work or you know all this stuff like but like yeah genuine connections really do go a long way and yeah i feel like just those little things putting the effort like going out to people's shows and like supporting them in person or all the all those things like really

35:44 Dion Kerr go so so much further than you can imagine like you could ask for all these favors just right in to people online but if you just were to go to one of their live performances Totally. and meet them in person and like hey let me buy you a drink and let's chat about this and then it's like you know those things go way further than um yeah sometimes it's like asking too much off

36:08 Dion Kerr Uh-huh. a stranger for something you know like Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I want to, so I want to talk a little bit about touring. So you brought up a very interesting point about how expensive it is to bring four people out on the road. And it's like, I feel like people, people look at touring, oh, that's how musicians make their money. It's like, yes, but also that's how they spend all their money. It's like, picture going on vacation.

36:32 Dion Kerr with a family of four and how expensive that is it's like you're basically doing the same thing but expecting to make money it's like there's a lot of kind of overhead you're you're currently on the road is that is that correct or you're

36:46 Dion Kerr Well, on the east I coast will you be, yeah, will next week, be soon got yeah. it next week so what's what what kind of run do you have coming up

36:52 Dion Kerr Just doing like some local stuff in New York and Nice. then back to Miami, I'm teaching at the University of Miami for a week and

36:59 Dion Kerr Cool. then I'm back in New York playing some shows, playing a festival in Miami as well with my band C4 Walls. We're doing three points. But this isn't a tour per se.

37:12 Dion Kerr Yeah, I'm just bouncing yeah. around doing a bunch of travel one-off dates this month. I just

37:17 Dion Kerr Very cool. Very cool. got off the road last week with Stephen Walls. We were just in like Chattanooga, Nashville the month before I was in Europe with Marcus Strickland.

37:28 Dion Kerr Cool. That's awesome. How was the Europe gig? How are the Europe gigs? Oh, those were amazing. Yeah, it's always fun to go overseas and

37:36 Dion Kerr how do you get around when you're in europe are you guys taking a van around are you taking trains what's or planes from nice

37:42 Dion Kerr we actually flew city to city, but then we had just, you know, buses or like little vans like between, you know, the smaller dates, but we would fly to different countries.

37:55 Dion Kerr gotcha That's which interesting. is always tough with a bass um All right. still like even to this day every time i get on a plane with the instrument that's stressful whether i can actually get it on or they're gonna you know make me try to put it under and get destroyed it's just that's

38:13 Dion Kerr Yep. something i wish was easier but Me too. I It's mean, you one of those things

38:18 Dion Kerr would think that like airlines at this point would like, like we've been doing this since airplanes were basically like commercially available musicians have been taking them with their gear and like.

38:29 Dion Kerr so much gear has gotten destroyed on an airplane like i remember one time my pedal board it was in a flight case too it got so destroyed it was just a bunch of pedals and wires and a plastic bag came down the conveyor i was like you kidding me luckily it worked it worked still but it was like it was like man that that is just so much risk especially when it's like those are the tools to do your job

38:54 Dion Kerr yeah it always breaks my heart when i see a post like my stuff is lost in transit or my stuff is destroyed or like a broken neck on a guitar bass like that's why i always insist on carrying it on the plane but that has challenges of its own in a way they have all these great cases now you know these hard shells but there's still the risk of it getting lost you know that's the thing that i still see oh it didn't miss the

39:21 Dion Kerr layover because the first plane was delayed and now your stuff is lost in transit so it's like I'd rather at least know okay my

39:30 Dion Kerr Yeah. instrument's with me Yeah. but a lot of times you have to you know figure out the ways like now i know which airlines which planes to take which

39:39 Dion Kerr Ooh, ones have storage closets which ones i can upgrade a seat and get an earlier boarding sometimes i'll have to be like oh let me get the extra leg room because i know i'm in boarding class too and i can get on early and get a spot for the base in the overhead so you

39:56 Dion Kerr yes. just learn all the tricks but it takes a lot of testing out there's been some planes where i'm like i'm not even gonna get on this flight because they're they're not gonna let me bring it on and like you have to argue luckily i've never missed a flight because of that like i've always somehow managed to get on but there's been some close calls for sure

40:16 Dion Kerr So any airlines that in particular you'd be like. fly this one or is it kind of hit and miss depending on where you're at yeah

40:24 Dion Kerr I think Delta, honestly, they're like one of the planes that still have the coat rack storage closet in the front.

40:31 Dion Kerr totally yeah mm So that's like one of the best ones because of that. -hmm They mm

40:37 Dion Kerr have the closet. A lot of other airlines have eliminated that closet space now where

40:41 Dion Kerr -hmm right they've just added more seats. like Spirit Airline Yeah, like Skrillex Blue is tough. Like, sometimes the one thing good about those ones is if you can get a low enough fare, you just buy two seats.

40:56 Dion Kerr Oh, so and nice. a lot of times i'll just you know you can do that i know jet blue has a option where you can select is this for an extra seat and it's for a musical instrument so sometimes they'll have low affairs where you might have an 80 flight and at that point i'm like maybe i'll just buy two tickets at least for the same price as another airline i can just have an extra seat and i put my bass there

41:21 Dion Kerr and you get an extra you know thing to put your backpack under and Right. stuff too so

41:26 Dion Kerr Yeah. but it's just like takes research every time I'm booking trips I'm just I gotta look at every single thing you know like

41:34 Dion Kerr compare all the prices how many is how much is two seats on this flight versus a

41:38 Dion Kerr yeah got regular delta one with this you know like so yeah all the tabs going yeah

41:44 Dion Kerr exactly right see i i think it's funny because i i think a lot of people that they just show up to a concert and they figure yeah the band got here somehow or like somebody takes care of all of that and like i don't think a lot of people realize all of the stuff that goes into it to uh to make a concert happen for people

42:03 Dion Kerr yeah i mean now like especially like the way everything runs now we have to be our own tour manager like um when my band seafoam went on the road with umo we we didn't have anyone we didn't have even the budget to take a fifth person on the road with us we had to make it work with just the four of us like because having a fifth person means one more hotel room means one more flight means a bigger car we can't fit an suv now we need uh

42:27 Dion Kerr one more flight means a bigger car we can't fit in an suv now we need That's a and

42:32 Luke F. Walton good point.

42:32 Dion Kerr a bigger vehicle so all those expenses were just too much like so we had to just eliminate all that and be like

42:41 Dion Kerr we got to just figure this out the four of us in the band and we're just going to do everything we book everything tour manage everything you know carry our own gear run our own sound we ran our own in-ears ran our own stage monitors ourselves like

42:58 Luke F. Walton Wow.

42:58 Dion Kerr so those are all the things that are so behind the scenes that we're preparing like months in advance of a

43:05 Luke F. Walton For sure.

43:06 Dion Kerr tour that even just looking like oh do we have to fly this tour what can we bring that means we can't bring amps so now

43:13 Luke F. Walton Right.

43:13 Dion Kerr we're flying how do we do an amp list rig all

43:16 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

43:16 Dion Kerr right let's run in ears and we're just going to send di's to the house and stuff like that it's always a problem problem solving depending on the situation and the gig if they have a back line if they don't there's so many variables and it's just like breaking down all that stuff like do we fly do we drive

43:35 Dion Kerr there really is a lot of it is on the artists these days so it's good to like get organized i feel like organization to me is still everything like

43:45 Luke F. Walton mm-hmm yeah

43:46 Dion Kerr being the most organized one is like always like that that's the only way you're going to get by you know having a calendar having a shared notes with everyone like

43:56 Luke F. Walton uh-huh totally

43:57 Dion Kerr it's just you need a couple of those guys in every band at least you know because

44:01 Luke F. Walton totally or you got like to become it because like i'm not naturally that way but i had that has been like a a place for improvement and practice and i've gotten a lot better at it the last couple years because otherwise otherwise it's just it's not going to happen like i'm just not going to be successful unless i i figure it out so i'm i'm working every every

44:22 Dion Kerr yeah

44:23 Luke F. Walton bit

44:23 Dion Kerr but

44:23 Luke F. Walton that i can to like get better at organized organizing stuff and get the drop box hierarchy and you know you gotta you gotta kind

44:30 Dion Kerr yeah

44:30 Luke F. Walton of you're do

44:31 Dion Kerr forced

44:31 Luke F. Walton it gotta

44:31 Dion Kerr to do it sometimes it's

44:32 Luke F. Walton do it

44:32 Dion Kerr just like all

44:33 Luke F. Walton it's

44:33 Dion Kerr right true you

44:33 Luke F. Walton yeah

44:34 Dion Kerr have this opportunity and there's no other way to go about it it's like all right we just gotta figure out that's that's the best thing about being an improviser in

44:43 Luke F. Walton Yeah,

44:44 Dion Kerr music and

44:44 Luke F. Walton right?

44:45 Dion Kerr in life it's really all is part of the same mentality of like a lot of this the career just happens like that it just unfolds and we don't know where it's going to go we have to just improvise our way and figure out the best solution to get through whatever it is if it's changes if it's you know figuring this stuff out it's like part of that stuff is like ties into the music as well like

45:11 Luke F. Walton Yeah. for sure i mean just like you're talking about you know you're going from gig you're going to go back teach hit a festival go back to do some other gigs it's like that is the that is the life of uh of artists nowadays it's like you're doing session work you're doing education you're doing um you're doing flight aids you're doing tours you're different multiple bands like that's that's and i also i want to talk to you real quick about um kind of music scoring for films

45:38 Luke F. Walton Because I know that you've done stuff Miami Film Festival, South by New Orleans Film Festival. Would love to kind of hear kind of your experience on that, just another hat that you wear.

45:49 Luke F. Walton But like, how did you get into it? And what was the workflow like? How did you go about it?

45:58 Dion Kerr um i just had some friends that were involved in it

46:01 Luke F. Walton Oh,

46:01 Dion Kerr and you know just so that kind of just got me into it just by osmosis through some people that i already knew that were doing that and um you know like i'm a visual artist as well like i started as a visual artist i painted and and drew i even was taking um oil painting classes in

46:20 Luke F. Walton oh, cool.

46:20 Dion Kerr in college before i really switched my focus to like like being fully music but I still see myself as a visual media artist first I feel like that was my first love and then I got into music so even

46:34 Luke F. Walton Yeah, cool.

46:34 Dion Kerr when I approach music to me it's coming from an artistic way like I see the music as the same as a blank canvas so I feel like I always take that approach to sound and like

46:50 Dion Kerr yeah like film scoring and stuff too but people told me my music fit um film and they always felt like it was a visual thing plus in my earlier days like I would make videos for um the music I was creating like even on my other YouTube page or my last album I created video works that were like art pieces that just were visualizers

47:15 Dion Kerr So my music, so I was creating things that were like that and I think that got my attention to some filmmakers as well, seeing

47:22 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

47:22 Dion Kerr like the visuals that I had created with

47:25 Luke F. Walton That makes sense.

47:25 Dion Kerr my music. And so I was just approached by some local people in Miami to soundtrack a film. And the first gig I got doing that, they actually just selected a song that I had already created to use for a project.

47:41 Dion Kerr but that went on to get some recognition and then you know I got on a list of film score people and composers and got on this mailing list and then I was able to interact with some other people that hit me up to actually create sounds for their scores but

47:59 Luke F. Walton Cool.

47:59 Dion Kerr a lot of it I feel like it's already built into the music I make I feel like I take that approach like I'm always seeing visuals When I create music, like I'm a very visual sensory person, like when I'm playing, I'm picturing things or colors or sounds, you know.

48:19 Luke F. Walton Yeah, yeah yeah tell me more about that so like do you uh do you think visually on different instruments like i know that some drummers think like with like shapes and stuff in mind because it's like physically laid out do you do kind of like do that kind of thing or how does that exactly work like is it mostly when you're soloing you're kind of like the next stage is coming to you in terms of like like evolution of a of a gradient or something like that is that is that kind of how that flows

48:47 Dion Kerr yeah definitely the shapes thing i

48:49 Luke F. Walton Shapesing?

48:49 Dion Kerr mean for sure because i feel like the shapes of music and mathematics and all these things are related in a way and i always found that stuff interesting but also just a general landscape of sound just being like is it something rigid or is it something flowing or is it something if i'm if i'm going to play some tension what is that creating to the waves like that i'm hearing like sometimes i

49:15 Dion Kerr I think of that stuff like, am I going to play with the waves or am I going to play against it and

49:20 Luke F. Walton Totally.

49:21 Dion Kerr create the tensions or, and film scoring is really nice when you can put the sonic stuff to the visuals like where you're able to create those moments that align with the visual. I really like doing that. I hope I get to do it more, but it really is special working with video and...

49:42 Dion Kerr and sound design is something i've always been interested in so i like implying sound design elements to my live shows as well like i'm one of those bass players who plays with a lot of effects pedals and stuff too that i know a lot of bass players may not use um effects i see it more now but like you know putting reverb on bass like

50:06 Luke F. Walton Yes.

50:06 Dion Kerr i'm i'm guilty of that like but like i'll be someone who just really likes sound design so i feel like i am always trying to incorporate those elements in everything i do

50:18 Luke F. Walton I like that a lot. And the way that you put it. really works for me for the are you going with the waves or against the waves i think

50:27 Dion Kerr Mm

50:27 Luke F. Walton about that

50:27 Dion Kerr -hmm.

50:27 Luke F. Walton a lot with like when i'm playing diads like two notes at a time but also you can think of that especially as a bass player

50:35 Luke F. Walton and the ways that you're you're changing like like every so every note has got a wave right and every different instrument has got a harmonic series and you can manipulate both of those things by the context that it's it's put in and the different waves that it's working against i love thinking like that because that's that's what we're doing but it is also feels like metaphysical it feels like a higher thing that you're you're like resonating or counter resonating

51:02 Luke F. Walton intentionally to amplify or diminish these things and i really like the way you put that i'm gonna use that i'm gonna keep that in

51:09 Dion Kerr No,

51:09 Luke F. Walton my back pocket

51:09 Dion Kerr definitely.

51:10 Luke F. Walton yeah

51:10 Dion Kerr Yeah,

51:10 Luke F. Walton that's yeah

51:10 Dion Kerr that's great.

51:11 Luke F. Walton it's good stuff um okay so last question thank you so much for for taking all this time with me super super super fun um great journey in uh in all this uh creative discourse but um i want to i want to end with a segment that we recently started called love music why and it's

51:30 Luke F. Walton why do you love music it's kind of like a moment for you to pitch especially like if you're thinking of like a 12 year old or something that's like getting into this that's starting it and it's like why did it make such an impact in your life like why is music that guiding force why have you given so much to it and like how could you share that to somebody even if they're like 70 or something like hey this is your time pick it up interact with it become this so i just want to pose that question to you

51:58 Luke F. Walton Why?

52:00 Dion Kerr music is really such a powerful force in my life i really i don't know who i would be with even out it but it's it's like i feel like it is a teacher of its own like playing music and it causes you to be more self-aware being aware of your surroundings having to interact with

52:22 Dion Kerr other musicians converse with people like it being a language beyond languages like it we can communicate with anyone around the world regardless if we speak the same language through music and

52:36 Luke F. Walton Mm-hmm.

52:36 Dion Kerr just like dealing with you know patience the patience that it takes to learn an instrument to learn a piece of music all these things are kind of like lessons that we have to teach ourselves when learning music and I really think

52:51 Dion Kerr There are even some bigger, great life lessons that come out of these lessons in music. It really is applicable to our life, like the patience, the understanding, the humility, being selfless on the bandstand to play the best music. It's not about showing off or being the best, and that's another thing, a great life lesson is being humble.

53:15 Dion Kerr respectful of one another you have to respect each other as musicians on the bandstand you have to respect the music I feel like everything that is a life lesson music embodies all of that and I really think yeah I've learned so much from music that I feel like is a part of who I am as a person because of my journey in music and I still love it every day like there's not a day

53:43 Dion Kerr i'm not excited to pick up an instrument there's a never-ending um platform of music it's just like every day i'm like there's something else that i could learn it's really going to be never ending so i feel like that drive is just always inspiring there's always something else you can learn there's always another instrument another sound another groove

54:06 Dion Kerr another production as technology goes on there's more pedals there's more of this like it's a never-ending spectrum of stuff so i feel like it's just like yeah i don't know how to conclude it um

54:22 Luke F. Walton No, it's great.

54:22 Dion Kerr yeah just like i feel like i'll always be inspired because of that and that's like a it's a good mentality to have being inspired and I don't know, it brings my mood up, you

54:34 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

54:35 Dion Kerr know, it makes me happy.

54:36 Luke F. Walton Yeah.

54:37 Dion Kerr Simple things like that too. Like I'm like, I'm just a huge advocate of learning music, even if it's you're doing it seriously as a full time thing or you're just playing for fun. I still feel like you can still get all of those things out of it, even if it's a hobby or you're trying to be a professional.

54:57 Luke F. Walton I agree. I agree. And I think that's beautifully said. It's a gift, and I love the sentiment of creates humility because, you know, sometimes people get a little cocky, sometimes you get good at it, and then you come back down to earth.

55:14 Luke F. Walton And that kind of maturity, I think, when you get that as a musician is a really powerful, like you're saying, life lesson. It makes you an easier person to just be around, play with.

55:28 Luke F. Walton and exist and create with so really really love the way that you're putting all that i encourage everybody to to check out your your work where would be the best place for people to to get in contact or check out all of your your goings on

55:43 Dion Kerr Well, on all streaming platforms is Dion Kerr. I'm on Bandcamp, dionkerr.bandcamp. My website is dnker.xyz and

55:53 Luke F. Walton Nice.

55:53 Dion Kerr then obviously my YouTube is under dialogues dnker dialogues But yeah, all streaming platforms, I have records out on everything.

56:04 Dion Kerr Awesome. Well, definitely encourage everybody to check out the incredible music and try and visualize just like Dion's doing when he's making it. Try and visualize, see what you see while you're listening to his music because there's a lot there.

56:16 Luke F. Walton Once again, I'm Scoobert Doobert. You can check out my stuff at scoobertdoobert.pizza. I love we both got the alternative URLs going and I really appreciate you joining. Joining the pod,

56:27 Dion Kerr Thanks Dion DeMucci. for having me. Thank you. Super fun. Thank you.